This can be a heater ordered without the adhesive, a heater being reinstalled, or a desire to have the heater glued on above the rated temperature of the 468MP adhesive. Once I wired this up, I ran the temperatures up past the fuse limits to verify things fail safely as expected. Printer is shutdown" klippy. 250 so it isn't left fully on for extended periods (this is assuming your heater circuit is okay with switching at a 100ms cycle rate) - run a pid tune on your bed (M303 E-1 S65) and use pid control on the bed (again, assuming the heater circuit is okay with pwm Oct 2, 2023 · I know this is not necessarily true with situations like the Voron where you have line voltages for print bed heaters and a second 5V power supply for Raspberry Pis but even these are relatively simple as well as being well documented and use modern, approved parts. We're proud to be recognized as a recommended source for your Voron needs. Notably, this design introduces added complexity, incorporating features like 4-point gantry tramming for precise alignment with the print surface, additional stepper motors, and other unique Keenovo Round Silicone Heater Pad with Digital Controller for 3D Printer Pyrex Evaporating Dish Vacuum Purging Chamber Tank Pot Bucket Circular Silicone Heater $87. Mar 16, 2024 · Hello Everyone! I'm early into my Voron journey and I have it hit a couple of challenges that I could use some help with. About halfway through the second layer the print stops and the printer shuts Aug 6, 2023 · I purchased the Fermio style Keenovo heater. I have done a PID calibration with no luck. 0-125-gbfb71bc2 moonraker v0. To display the chamber temperature on the front panel display, additional configuration is required. I tried turning the fans off completely yet it still failed. Ten minutes is not bad but I'd be happier with a 100W heater. And though e3d has replaced the previous two, this is now becoming te Welcome to the Ender 3 community, a specialized subreddit for all users of the Ender 3 3D printer. See the verify_heater section in doc/Config_Refference. #max_delta: 2. cfg file and can't find sections that have the default settings. In this video I’ll talk about how owning a Voron today is way easier than it used to be. 1) Cut the two small red PTFE sensor wires ( usually 22AWG), some Keenovo Digital Controller has them in a white sleeve, cut Electrical Wiring Safety Note . Meter the two heater bed leads and see if there is an open circuit. 4 Configurator This configurator is designed to provide a customized bill of materials for your VORON2. Steps and guides for getting filament printing just right. 0 # On 'watermark' controlled heaters this is the number of degrees in # Celsius above the target temperature before disabling the heater # as well as the number of degrees below the target before # re-enabling the heater. Initial Preparation The default is fan_speed. See part of printer. I set the max temperature to 110 Celsius for the tuning. Measuring the heater resistance confirms a heater failure. min_temp: 0. And we recommend running under 220v voltage environment. Mar 15, 2018 · Some things that you may want to explore: - set the heater_bed max_power to 0. Here is instructions from Keenovo. 2 fluidd v1. I then moved the ground wire to run from the fuse rather than the tab. There have been reports of Octopus boards coming preloaded with a firmware that turns on all heaters and fans as soon as you power up the board. 3, added smooth_line, done PID tuning and the problem still persists. Oct 6, 2023 · I turned on my Trident, started up Fluidd and immediately noticed a heater temperature of 300 degrees and smoke coming from the hot end. 0 klipper v0. For maximum flowrate the Dragon Ace™ utilizes Orginal Dragon's HF heat breaker design along with a volcano style heater block. Tuning steps and processes after everything is working. Get the Formbot kit because it’s reasonably priced and other people have already built the kit and written up notes. g. If you look at the log the lower temperature is constant for some time, It pretty much prints first layer and then fails. 8. I’m using this type hotend: Amazon. Because it happens at the same space, I don’t think it is an intermitted hardware problem Reported error: Heater extruder not heating at expected rate" while trying to complete a 15hr print. If the voltage stays high and doesn't drop when the temperature starts falling, then the heater is probably broken. 0 kick_start_time: 0. This cause the heater to partially detach and cook itself. Resliced the file with the print stopping at the same point. 0 # A temperature (in Celsius) that the heater must drop below before For VORON, please check our popular pads of 100mm x 100mm, 200mm x 200mm, 240mm x 240mm/250mm x 250mm, 300mm x 300mm for VORON V0 120, V1/V2 250, V1/V2 300, V1/V2 350 respectively Skip to content Submit The Voron 2. 3 [verify_heater heater_chamber] max_error: 900 check_gain_time: 900 hysteresis: 5 heating_gain: 2 Saved searches Use saved searches to filter your results more quickly Get started with VORON 3D printer, the best little CoreXY 'space shuttle' you can build in your garden shed, or your kitchen. Does anyone have any suggestions. VORON2. shutdown_speed: 1. It did not look like there was a Klipper log file attached to this ticket. #heater: #stepper: # Name of the config section defining the heater/stepper that this fan # is associated with. 0 doesn't have CAN bus headers direct on board. config, and restart the host software. 7 MB) MCU / Printerboard: btt manta8p 2. 3 KB) Describe your issue: Just swapped my 3rd rinter to Klipper. Keep getting the following error: _Heater extruder not heating at expected rate See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference. In some cases the bed heater may need / want to be installed with something other than the normally provided 468MP adhesive sheet. It works fine, but the sensor is only used to control the heater temperature and not the chamber temperature. VORON 2. After disconnecting the heater I measured 24V on the heater connector, which surely isn't right. zip (4. 4R2 Fystec Spider 2. 4 as per BOM, CW1 with hartK PCB, Octupus V1. There are 326 products. 4, designed by VORON DESIGN, represents an enhanced CoreXY design featuring a stable bed and a gantry that moves vertically along the Z-axis. Do newer Keenovo heaters come with builtin thermal fuses? Dec 14, 2022 · The Voron Forum has chosen to be supported by selected banner ads from our trusted vendors. For the heater I used 20 ga wire. The heater_temp should not go over 120°C. KB3D "MinMax" 120V Silicone Heater for Voron V2. Verify Heaters and PIDs. control: watermark. Apr 4, 2022 · I have searched my printer. #chamber is treated as a heater [heater_generic chamber] heater_pin: PD14 # here not the heater but the fan that cools the heater. x. PID_CALIBRATE HEATER=extruder Apr 22, 2020 · "Heater extruder not heating at expected rate See the 'verify_heater' section in config/example-extras. As such, it seems to be limited to 40 watts or so with some possible issues with overheating. Currently goes to 250(ABS) and then waits until it drops to 150 before probing. Jan 13, 2024 · Basic Information: Printer Model: voron trident klippy logs. 10 ## Hotend Fan - FAN1 [heater_fan hotend_fan] pin: PE5 max_power: 1. Size and Mar 7, 2023 · The thermistor or heater is bad, or you have a bad wire or terminal connection. 4r1 MCU / Printerboard: BTT Octopus 1. That banner is the only advertisement that will ever appear. However I can't find this in my config file. Had to do this on all 3 of my Stealthburners with SB2240s in them. None of the other non-LDO kit-makers have anything that felt like a clear upgrade over the Formbot kit. We’ve applied it to make the metal ceramic heater inside the Revo HeaterCore. I think there are some people using 750W heaters The next issue is power consumption. END STANDARD VORON WARING. txt file I noticed my heater extruder temp was slowly dipping with PID set high. Any help with this? Sep 22, 2021 · I am having a problem with a print failing with “Heater extruder not heating at expected rate” at the same point in the print. If a comma separated list of heater/stepper names # is provided here, then the fan will be enabled when any of the given # heaters/steppers are enabled. A key file must not be modified, otherwise you cannot open your database anymore. 4 & Trident! We combined all the best features of other bed heater options while shedding the annoying "gotcha's" Options: Choose your build size! 250mm (255mm Bed): 244x244 - 300W - 120V. Apr 4, 2022 · That "max_power" setting does not really reduce the power going into the heater, it merely reduces the amount of time that the heater is being energised in any given unit of time. BEGIN Sep 19, 2023 · Hi when I start a print the bed temp goes up OK but then the nozzle goes up to print temp but I want it to go to 150 degrees before probing. Feb 13, 2023 · Heater <name> not heating at expected rate Background A heater (typically either extruder or bed) is not able to reach or maintain the target temperature Reasons Often this points to some hardware problems with the heater Damaged heating cartridge Damaged cables / connectors that are supplying the heater Damaged / burned MOSFET on the printer-board Target temperatures set too high for the Sep 21, 2022 · In my Voron I do have a tiny bit of airflow (don't know how turbulent it is, it is just there to apply a very weak underpressure to keep fumes in, not to move much air) but enclosure temperatures are at 50-60°C. Always double check to make sure your printer is unplugged and the capacitors in the power supplies have discharged before touching any wire or terminal. I located this code in the Config_Reference. Sep 13, 2022 · Cross referencing between Voron Initial Start Up and Klipper Config Checks. max_power: 1. Can someone tell me what steps I need to take to do this. It seems like the heater is very slow at reaching the target temperature (going to 60 takes around 10 mins) for a 110V heater. 2 klippy. 2 MB) I was trying to heat the dragon flow hot end to 210 C, i am the getting the sa&hellip; Jul 26, 2023 · I just spliced it to make it longer. 4 build. For bed leveling: If printer is a V1: Under [z_tilt] and [screws_tilt_adjust], uncomment the lines that correspond with your printer’s size We're available 24/7 in the #KB3D channel of the official Voron Discord. In fact I watched the heater and it was fine. I am currently using a Duet Wifi board and doing PID tuning for the bed. To get the chamber temperature, I added another sensor to monitor the You signed in with another tab or window. #heater_temp: 50. Checked that the part cooling fan does not effect the temperature. I found a suitable candidate at my local Walmart on clearance for $5. a hash that allows to verify the integrity of the key). cfg: ## Controller fan - FAN2 [controller_fan controller_fan] pin: PD12 kick_start_time: 0. The lag in MIC6 absorbing heat cause the center of the heater to reach temps higher than what 3M adhesive was rated for. 0. Feb 19, 2023 · # Name of the config section defining the heater that this fan is # associated with. It is recommended to use odd values for numbers of points in X and Y, (such as 3x3, 5x5, or 7x7) , so that there is always a probe point directly in the center of your bed. v1. md The #max_error: 120 probably needs to be increased. Mar 27, 2024 · [verify_heater chamber_heater] #setup chamber heater verification parameters max_error: 120 check_gain_time: 240 hysteresis: 5 heating_gain: 1 [heater_fan heater_fan] #setup fan attached to back of chamber heater pin: PE4 #Manta 8P fan output pin. cfg. 29. max_temp: 110 [verify_heater Oct 4, 2023 · Basic Information: Printer Model: voron2. 1 MCU / Printerboard: OrangePi Zero2W / Duet 3 Mini klippy. Aug 3, 2023 · After a few months of printing, I had the same thing happen turn out to be the thermo-fuse was open. md. These values are predefined to 350 mm for my printer and need to be adjusted to be the actual distance from the Feb 7, 2024 · Quick question on the fan logic with a new LDO 2. 4 is designed to get sufficient chamber heat from the two existing heaters (bed and hot-end). md for the parameters that control this check. 5 heater: heater_bed fan_speed: 0. 300mm (305mm Bed): 295x295 - 500W - 120V Nov 23, 2022 · Voron 2. 4′s X limit switch is on the right and the Y limit switch actuates on the back; so the Voron homes to the back right and Klipper sets the current X and Y coordinates to the respective position_endstop values when homing. 1 300 heat soak for ~30 mins before even thinking of starting to print. Feb 7, 2024 · At some point if ther heater is too large the control is unstable. I've reached out to their tech support. 4-350 Packing box of heated bed kit 385x386 ; 😀Our Voron heated bed kit Supports 220V, control voltage DC5V~24V. Both the bed and the hotend will heat up and reach their set points at the start of a print, and the gantry goes through the quad mesh level with klicky, and then begins the print. We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. As a result, we recommend leaving the heaters disconnected until after loading the klipper firmware. 1 with ebb 36 V1. Basically, watch for smoke and bubbles forming on the heater pad. Tuning Guides . Reload to refresh your session. The log file has been engineered to answer common questions the Klipper developers have about the software and its environment (software version, hardware type, configuration, event timing, and hundreds of other questions). md | Recv: // for the parameters that control this check. The design uses spare hotend parts to increase the chamber temperature. The Voron 2. M301, M303), but all I see defined on the Klipper GitHub is the " PID_CALIBRATE HEATER " command and not any actual G-code commands. Jun 21, 2022 · The biggest impact on print quality comes with improper heatbed PID tuning in Klipper. A key file is a file that contains a key (and possibly additional data, e. cfg for the parameters that control this check. 4. Feb 17, 2022 · First I drilled a 1/8" hole next to the center ground pin, rivetted the fuse to the heater's core, and applied thermal grease between the fuse body and the heater core. I've gone though 2 500w heaters after over-driving them due to the thermistor being mounted on the edge. Hopefully I can get some resolution or a replacement. 35 squared is 1225. Had to lengthen the TC wire as well. Sep 13, 2022 · See the ‘verify_heater’ section in docs/Config_Reference. I now had a failure 80 % through a 8hour print. If I have to spend nearly $40 to replace a combined heater/thermistor, then I would likely just put that money towards a different hotend. Regular price $29. The default is "extruder". 0 Host: orangepi CM4 debian 11 PSU: Meanwell UHP500 24v umbilical setup with toolhead pcb my printer is sealed with some insulate foam, chamber temp usually gets up to 65C. Worked fine for months. Highlight: Dragon Ace™ can be installed with MZE (melting zone extender), the total length of the hot-side can reach up to 40MM ② , and the maximum practical flow rate can reach up to 74mm³/S ③ Feb 17, 2022 · First I drilled a 1/8" hole next to the center ground pin, rivetted the fuse to the heater's core, and applied thermal grease between the fuse body and the heater core. Feb 16, 2023 · Must say, I am seriously loosing faith in this hotend. Voron V2 - BTT Octopus (Pro) Wiring . and because everybody uses glass on their printers) so it takes time to heat glass, especially when it's cold outside (like it is now) In my experience I find that I get much better adhesion when I let my 2. Note: Versions covered by this guide are v1. We find it sneaky to rewrite links for profit, so we don't do it and don't allow others to either. Just don't try and remove or cut into the heater mat is the main thing. | Recv . Even with proper sealing my printer sometimes requires a lengthy heat soak so I decided to add a supplemental PTC chamber heater. Octopus 1. 2 MB) I was trying to heat the dragon flow hot end to 210 C, i am the getting the sa&hellip; Sep 24, 2022 · Yet, you can’t buy a Voron off the shelf. Unlike conventional heaters, our design doesn’t rely on nichrome wire at all. 2020-04-21. When wiring your printer electronics, you will be working with line voltage wiring (120V / 220V AC). Filament Tuning . Aug 24, 2022 · `##### Chamber Heater ##### [heater_generic heater_chamber] heater_pin: PB11 # HE3 sensor_type: EPCOS 100K B57560G104F # Stock sensor_pin: PF5 # T1 control: watermark max_delta: 2. To avoid melting the chamber heater housing, I added a temperature sensor on the heater and defined it in the chamber_heater section. /r/3DPrinting is a place where makers of all skill levels and walks of life can learn about and discuss 3D printing and development of 3D printed parts and devices. 4 / Trident. I am going to guess that you print in the center of the bed? If this happens only in a certain spot on the bed, its a broken wire or bad connection on the toolhead, if its random the thermistor or heater is bad. This is also a good time to do the PID calibrations. Oct 28, 2023 · Basic Information: Printer Model: Voron v0. Set the part fans to 25% (M106 S64) and run. I pid tuned when setting up the printer. Having a thicker plate would slow down the rate of temperature change and allow a larger heater. I didn't change anything on my perfectly working printer. The file extension typically is 'keyx' or 'key'. Meet our new MinMax silicone heaters for Voron V2. Many Git commands accept both tag and branch names, so creating this branch may cause unexpected behavior. You switched accounts on another tab or window. 0 # fan will turn off below this level. 5 heater: extruder heater_temp: 50. Jun 1, 2023 · You'll get the most reliable result if you can measure the voltage across the bed heater at the connections closest to the heater. A couple of small test prints completed with mi We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. 0 max_power: 1. One complaint I have with my brand new V0 is that it takes about 10 minutes to heat the bed to 105 C. Here, enthusiasts, hobbyists, and professionals gather to discuss, troubleshoot, and explore everything related to 3D printing with the Ender 3. Do not leave HE0 or HE1 connected. Nov 2, 2019 · Hi @4noxx,. 4 costs. This process should be run with every brand and type of filament, and potentially even between different colors as pigment can affect filament performance. Oct 4, 2023 · Basic Information: Printer Model: voron2. 4-350 Weighted pearl cotton of heated bed kit 385x385,1 pcs* VORON 2. Voron Official and Community Documentation Oct 25, 2018 · also I have a glass upon it, because flat factory heater needs something heavy upon it. 0-324-ga3e4dac5 #1 - Hotend fan RPM Monitoring I was following Sep 28, 2023 · Can change cycle_time (increase) ## if your fan is not able to slow down effectively off_below: 0. Delete the others to prevent confusion. Apr 16, 2022 · About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright Keenovo Silicone Heater for VORON 3D Printer with Fermio Style Build Plate HeatBed Heating Mat. Dec 11, 2022 · If replacing the bed thermistor (I've had to replace one of mine a while back) follow these simple instructions. It's a part for a Voron 3D printer, a lot of people have printed the part, so the design of the part should be fine. Jun 26, 2022 · I work with an active chamber heater. If either one of them is heating on its own immediately power down your printer to prevent damage to the printer and its surroundings. 14 Keenovo Silicone Heater 370mm x 375mm for Ender 5 Plus 3D Printer Build Plate HeatBed Heating Upgrade A tag already exists with the provided branch name. However, I am getting some very poor quality bridging. I do not know why this is happening… some models are printed 100%, other models are halted at a random height? Nov 27, 2022 · Heater extruder not heating at expected rate See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference. Installing Heater with RTV . Klipper and mainstail installed and configured without any apparent issues, initial startup checks complete with no issues, SuperSlicer setup and configured with no issues. ” I use a standard e3d 24v 40W heater cartridge, after checking my klippy. com: Haldis 3D Upgraded Rapid Heat V6 Hotend 24V 48W Ceramic Heating Core The pid_Kp, pid_Ki, and pid_Kd # parameters must be provided for PID heaters. For reference: Voron 2. Jul 19, 2024 · This is a box for a chamber heater for my Voron 2. 0 ## Controller fan - FAN2 [controller_fan Sep 20, 2021 · I am having a problem with a print failing with "Heater extruder not heating at expected rate" at the same point in the print. I change some bits ther Mar 5, 2024 · heater_temp: 30. Basically the board cannot reduce the level of power - the heater port is basically either on at full power (24v) or completely off. Starting with the bed set each heater to 50 deg and observe the temperature rise. 97 Sale. Is the hype deserved and how relevant a Voron still is in the age of highspeed printers like the Bambulab X1, that you can buy ready-to print, off the shelf for less than a Voron 2. Was working briliant with RepRapFirmware with same extruder temp values asked to do PID for. 0 only. You signed out in another tab or window. log (4. 8, max_power for heated bed to 0. if you have any questions, please feel free to contact us, we will reply within 24 hours. log Voron Official and Community Documentation. At the base of the wiring, there is a thermal fuse-shaped lump which I can't identify in the square style heaters seen in Nero's videos. I had heater wire in my stash but silicone should also be fine. None of the Voron printers include a chamber heater so setting the chamber temperature will not function. And this is the third brand new Revo hotend this has happened to. Under [heater_bed], verify the temperature sensor type is correct. Apr 1, 2023 · BEGIN STANDARD VORON WARING NOTE: Voron Design does not recommend the use of additional chamber heating due to the increased risk of fire. 4r2 built from a formbot kit (now with many mods) 2x bed fans The fans in the Nevermore and the bed fans are all GDSTIME 5015 12V GDB5015. The chamber temperature will now be displayed and graphed in the temperature chart. 4r2 build: There is this section in Klipper's printer. Sometimes, the heating algorithm is not PID, which means that the heater will always use 100% of the power and then cycle back to 0% until the set temperature is reached. Oct 2, 2023 · One pretty hands-on approach could be: Disconnect everything from the PSU With a multimeter, measure its no-load voltage across the V-out (+ /-) clamps → Should be 24V Take the heating cartridge out from heat block Put it on a fire-proof surface Connect it to V out of the PSU After a while, the cartridge should even start glowing red If not, measure again the voltage on the V-out clamps → Apr 13, 2022 · 1 pcs* VORON 2. Apr 6, 2020 · Note: When first powering up your printer immediately check if your hotend and bed heaters are staying cold. for the parameters that control this checkOnce the underlying issue is corrected, use the. sensor_type: Generic 3950. sensor_pin: PF4 #interior sensor. Printer is shutdown Aug 12, 2022 · I just saw a clever design in the Voron Mods section for an experimental build chamber heater. Jumper selected for 12V Dec 11, 2022 · Heater extruder not heating at expected rate Transition to shutdown state: Heater extruder not heating at expected rate See the ‘verify_heater’ section in docs/Config_Reference. log. 0 min_temp: 0 max_temp: 110 pwm_cycle_time: 0. I replaced the thermistor, set the max_power for the extruder to 0. Feb 3, 2024 · Get a Voron Zero so that I have a small printer that can print all of the ABS parts for a Voron Trident down the road at home. This happens about 3 minutes into the print. 12. Once the underlying issue is corrected, use the "FIRMWARE_RESTART" command to reset the firmware, reload the config, and restart the host software. I'm going to provide config details for other versions where I can find it, but I can't verify function as I don't have hardware to test. 1 Describe your issue: I have a heater_generic chamber_heater setup and with a controller_fan chamberHeater_fan to preheat the chamber that I wanted to only come on when the heater was active, but instead the fan would also be active when any stepper was active as well. I tried running a temperature tower, and it comes out seemingly perfect, even though the bridges on this tower are longer than the bridge on the Voron part. 1 board Please help ! Heater heater_bed not heating at expected rate. log klippy (6). . If a comma separated list of heater names is # provided here, then the fan will be enabled when any of the given # heaters are enabled. log (211. [gcode_macro PRINT_START] gcode: # This part Feb 4, 2021 · | Recv: !! Heater heater_bed not heating at expected rate | Changing monitoring state from "Printing" to "Cancelling" | Recv: ok | Send: N10635 M108*43 | Recv: // Heater heater_bed not heating at expected rate | Recv: // See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference. Mar 9, 2024 · I see that I can buy a 100mm x 100mm 100 Watt heater designed for 120 volts AC in Aliexpress for only about $13. YMMV. 4 MCU / Printerboard: BTT Manta M8P V1. 1 and v2. Oct 6, 2022 · Basic Information: Printer Model: Voron 2. Turns out this is by design in controller_fan Jul 14, 2022 · I just finished my build, V2. [verify_heater heater_confi Jul 5, 2022 · It seems like this one pops up regularly on github and in the forum, and every time someone follows up saying “it’s your hardware” (wiring, heater block, etc) but in my case, with the AnyCubic Vyper, I am very much doubting this because: A) I can print the exact same print using the Marlin firmware + Octoprint and none of the thermals look in any way odd - the temperature ramp looks good Jun 1, 2023 · I have a bit of a strange issue here. Under [display] Uncomment the display configuration section that matches the installed display. RepRap was doing 310deg with no issue, klipper shwoing fault and asking for check “verify_heater”. but I doubt we are even close to this point. FIRMWARE_RESTART command to reset the firmware, reload the. I can also set the heater to 300 as I have upgraded the hotend. 6W/mm^2 is 735. You can verify that the Heater Bed has heated up by using an infrared thermometer, or a method of your choice (you can use your hand here by hovering above the bed, just be careful not to touch it directly); Jul 18, 2021 · I can not figure out what is going on. The inspiration for this project came largely from the posting by ahough on Team FDM although I took a slightly different approach as I wanted a integrated thermal safety switch instead of a thermal fuse. Display Configuration . Hi, I'm very new to Klipper and want to PID tune both my hot end and my bed. 5 Which based on the Klipper config reference, "will be enabled Jan 14, 2022 · The potted assembly is wrapped in a silicone sock to keep the heater stable and protect you from burns Screen printing is a technique often used to make PCBs or funky t-shirt designs. I know for Marlin, I send G-code commands (e. Nov 12, 2022 · My heater has no problem getting to that temperature. Generally a 5x5 grid is acceptable for even the largest Voron printer, but you can adjust the points as you see fit. 0 ## If you are experiencing back flow, you can reduce fan_speed #fan_speed: 1. Repeat for the extruder heater. fy md gw kf or jc yy wr gq ho